I wouldn't use YNAB without it. But, sometimes it’s not always easy … Record the original purchase as a split between your portion (to Feed or whatever) and the remainder as an outgoing transfer to the Pending Reimbursements account categorized as Feed Reimbursement. But in the same token I'm careful not to make my budget useless. I don't like how the overspending isn't obvious once the month  changes. Still trying to implement dakinemaui 's pre-funded buffer and have had to undo my own errors and methodology nearly every month. This is just what it is at the moment. I'm just not really following how the offset account will work. The CC Payment category takes care if itself. So this is no help. That little red arrow kept everything in front of me where I could see it. After all, they do so within a given category. But nothing returns to zero... there's debt. if you can't spend more than is in the envelope, why does YNAB allow this? You know them). Posted by 3 years ago. When my work gives me $1,000 to pay me back for a conference, yes, it'd be great to just budget that $1,000 to home decor. So here we are I had $20 available. That handles all the this vs. next month issues, including one they didn't even consider (additional reimbursements made after submitting your expense report but before receiving the money). Yes, you should be inflowing reimbursements  directly to the category. But I see a bigger issue in that a new user who is not aware of what is really going on when they overspend may rely on untrustworthy numbers to make decisions and possible even overdraw their account, so I think from the standpoint of a forced fix shouldn't be a month out when the overspending occurs at or near the beginning of the month is problematic. I think if you fully consider the ramifications of a rolling correction period, you'll quickly find it's really not an improvement. Pink Drum it seems more ridiculous to me that Ynab has said since launch that they  have no intentions of changing this and people continue to come here and rant about it. Sometimes payments for products I have ordered for other people leave me over spent across a month. It just lets you completely ignore all your negative balances from the previous month and carry on. I'm sure there's a long complicated reason that won't work for you, but nothing is perfect for everyone. It made it easy to see, track, and deal with. The result was getting rid of the red arrow, and introducing the credit card payment category. That's actually taking money away from me, because of a software limitation - Yikes! Cover the other category's overspending. It's hard to stand by while people sully a generally nice forum to be, but I'm going to try to move on again. My view is that every CC purchase is immediately debt, and the yellow overspent category is merely a warning that I have no plan in place to pay that debt off. We're making you much more money, why not give us what some of us want with a simple ability to change a setting. I've also tried manually recreating the category deficit (in a test budget, I haven't done a month end, yet) and tried covering the overspending from another category and creating a future inflow for the amount of the reimbursement, adjust the balance as money comes in. If you are more than a month ahead by more than what was over spent, you won't notice for a couple of months that categories were over spent. you've been reimbursed. nolesrule I've tried. As far as I can tell, they are mostly new users who haven't understood how to use different accounts as sources of payments yet. Slate Blue Sander If I have any category overspends, I do not address them until I do my end of month review and before I allocate the next months budget. I didn't get into their program to do what they do, but to use their tool in a way that worked for me. A general purpose Qustodio Parent Portal enhancing browser extension for Chrome and Firefox. The brilliant idea inside YNAB, though, is this: Budget balances carry over from month to month. I realize you were probably venting/commiserating and that I may be butting in where I'm not wanted, so I won't press the issue any further unless you wish more details. nolesrule  What do you mean by "YNAB will correct any overspending you left in the previous month if you don't fix it, by removing it from the money you can budget going forward." The spin that it's a bad practice just doesn't stand up in all situations. Think of YNAB like an electronic envelope budgeting system. Your assets remain untouched. Until then, I have to be creative. Brandon I still use YNAB4. .PS. HappyDance This only works if you like to see no "red/orange" at the end of the month, and don't follow the ostrich mentality of ignoring the fact that your actual CC balance goes up but your over spending disappears on the first. mjrudolphi Are you trying to be helpful? I think it's just how people think about budgets. Zeroing a negative balance defeats that purpose. roll with the punches. I'm beyond frustrated with this. How does all this work within the budget? I'm also not arguing with your solution. I've spent about 20 hours (support, training, videos, reading articles, elbow grease) in the past few weeks trying to migrate data and change my philosophical approach in the areas of "overspending". Don't get me wrong, this should not be the default behavior. So I will red arrow that difference and make it up within the next month or two. dakinemaui Thanks! The app and web app are both top notch. It's a backup plan to keep you following the Rules. And I would hazard a guess that the vast majority of YNAB's customers are in the same boat. Click on the negative balance and select "subtract from next month's available balance". Yes, this has a large impact on "being ahead" / "living on last month's income". My negative balances get handled within the next month. Now see by sharing that I'm sure I will get everyone saying how horrible I am for allowing that. The only thing about the zeroing out at the beginning of the month is that it effectively wipes out any over spending I had. It's not the rolling over into next month that's considered a violation, it's not correcting the overspending immediately that's a violation. (More accurately, extend the influence of the budget entries to include the actual dates, but that's hardly a material distinction.) WordTenor Oh crappers, I was in the middle of editing that post to say ok, I get what you're saying, do a negative then replace it to net zero. YNAB wants to build YNAB software, not generic software (plus there's a lot of generic software out there). How are things over there? Almost all of the reasons can be managed with differing methods in nYNAB. I found it extremely motivating and gave me great areas of focus. Payments are now inflow transfers from the Pending Reimbursement account categorized to Feed Reimbursement. (Imagine 10 kids contributing to a cabin). I want to choose how to handle these situations when they happen. Back to the original point - I would prefer the ability to CHOOSE when I roll an over spent category over into the next month or not. But the YNAB people are very nice about it. I agree with needing the ability to carry forward an over spent category. I'm just agreeing with you and giving the logical way they could organize it. I'm glad YNAB methodology is helping people get out of debt, my method did the same for myself and the software and myself had a good "compromisable marriage." it is a violation of YNAB rule 3. If the balance should be positive include a positive indicator '+' before the amount. Make sure you categorize both outflows and inflows to the reimbursement category. I would rather have a way to specify that for this particular category, every overspending is carried over to the next month as a negative balance for this category, instead of being deducted from the overall budget. If your negative balance is on a a credit card, it will accrue as new debt. My gym membership is paid by the year, but YNAB won't let me carry a negative forward for the next 12 months until it's zero, because YNAB wants me to save up the 12-months worth of gym membership before I pay for it. These are support forums. Making a float stop at the month makes more global sense than any other arbitrary line, and the infrastructure is already set up to allow me to go back and fix if I wish. bevocat Nothing like embracing reality! Can't. As long as the Available amount is still green, it's all good—there's no reason to worry about that negative number! But that doesn’t let me know exactly what I have left to collect! The red category is the indication there's an issue. {I decided to delete my original comment because it's a waste discussing here.}. It's worse than "not obvious" -- it's flat out misleading. This was the deal-breaking feature for me because it … Yes, these are realities. I have a number of items that come out at the first of the month and depending on what day that may fall, the payment may come out at the end of the month. It ignores overspending when the purchases were on a credit card, because you told YNAB you were buying something on credit without backing it by cash. farfromtheusual In your example, I would use a dedicated Feed Reimbursement category so that money doesn't interfere with whatever you're budgeting for the next purchase of your own animal's feed (perhaps treating this as a true expense to minimize the hit per month). I have an almost constant problem with the web app version because it will not carry forward negative balances, and this screws up all my tracking. I would have stomached the subscription but not so much now. Annieland Yeah I thought of that as well. (I know, probably not a surprise to you.). I think all any of us are asking for is the flexibility to choose which way we'd like to work with our money. It lets you spend more than is shown, displays a negative, and doesn't make you do anything about it, and doesn't penalize you in the next month other than your balances not making any sense, which we human beings won't notice right away until the difference is stark. Now, Rule 3 is still called Roll with the Punches; but now it means moving money from categories that have it to the overspent category in order to zero it out. It happens quite frequently with my rent which is on autopay. For example, I budgeted $20/mo for my trash service, which is … Right now I have large purchases that are financed and I have to go back to the original month of the purchase to be able to make adjustments to the debt owed. No thanks. I'm using the overspend method   It works fine as long as all the transaction work in a given calendar month. Now you've broken the easily understood logic that a category balance is what you used to have (last month) plus what you've put in (budgeted) minus what you've spent (activity). But just because there are some UI issues in some cases that still need to be fixed doesn't justify doing it intentionally. When I finally do receive funds, particularly if it comes in with a couple other payments at the same time, it is very easy to forget that money needs to be paid directly to the CC as an "extra payment" because there is no budget category that is reminding me that it needs to go there. Negatives don't...? It was built for people who are so on the edge and require an accurate budget that  lying to themselves in this manner would be hugely detrimental. Whereas if you float a purchase at the grocery store made on say the 10th of the month until you get paid again on the 12th ynab has no problem just complaining of the overspending, but from the 30th to the 1st it handles it differently which is essentially a walled off month. In broad theory, the system considered overspending now to be borrowing this month's income that properly should be budgeted in next month. Carry negative balance. And I obviously didn't want that account off budget as I use it for personal expenses as well. register a sa forums account here! I try to stuff my airline category but sometimes when a good airfare comes up, I may be a couple of hundred dollars short. As much as I find a lot of things about YNAB super duper annoying, I agree with WordTenor that no one should be surprised that YNAB is building a software that is modeled on the YNAB methodology. mamster I find Splitwise invaluable when both parties are making charges. nolesrule The over spent indicator is always Zero when a month rolls over - always. The former Rule 4 (originally Rule 1, way back when) called for Living on Last Month's Income, and waiting till next month to budget the income you receive this month was conceived as a financial buffer. I can say for sure that we'll never have a "carry over negative balance" option. (YNAB's official documents are in error in this respect, suggesting use of Inflow: To Be Budgeted in some cases, and will lead to issues with reporting and spending totals.). Look to this tracking account balance for what's owed rather than the category. I suggest you also cover this from your CC Payment category. It sounds from the various posts in this thread, and the fact that you’re still having the same issues three months on,  that your new business isn’t tenable for you. The red category is the indication there's an issue. You overspend your reimbursable category. After the initial pangs of discomfort and reluctance, not to mention annoyance, I found the results very effective. Bruce Yes! nolesrule I'm curious as to how YNAB automates this? I don't like having to rebuild budget categories and micromanage those values because of some unexpected thing I can  handle myself,  like an adult. Not a lot of "remembering" involved. I've been doing pretty well at knocking out any yellow (usually in a fun money type category) immediately, and work reimburseables are few and far between now and I just take from reg income and nag my husband. If you ignore that your card balance is going up and up, and keep overspending and not correcting it, at some point, you have to take responsibility for doing that. I HAVE to find a way to deal with the reimbursement issues , without letting things reset to zero. If I'm not SUPER careful when I get paid for those things, it is very easy for me to just drop that money into a category that I need to fund, forgetting that I should put that directly onto my credit card. We both know they aren't going to change anytime soon, so it's either adapt on our part or use a competitor. YNAB took that money away from November’s Available to Budget number. Just discovering this thread now after writing to YNAB directly about this issue. Sometimes there just wasn't enough money at the end of the month. I knew building a business wouldn't be easy, but dang, it's not easy!! Maybe it exists and I didn't find it or there is another way to do it; if not, consider this a feature request ;) I have a category "Computer Games" and every month I budget 10$ and it accumulates and then I have enough money to buy something and everything is fine.... Now let's say I have just emptied my savings for computer games and now there is a sale for … So while my situation is ridiculously TIGHT right now, it won't be this way forever. Yes I know it shows up under the balance under the accounts, but that doesn't help my ability to track it appropriately for my business. That doesn't mean we should give them a chance to fix it first. Steel Blue Cleric I know this is an old thread but this is exactly the reason I found this! I use the toolkit, so I don't know if this is what shows in toolkit or YNAB without it, BUT when I went in and added a second rent payment it immediately showed me that I am overspent in rent by making the category red. If you leave a category overspent month to month to month, where's the money coming from to fund your other categories or to make the credit card payment? My age of money is 60 days, I'm so far ahead, that small over spending in budgets don't show up in any of the indicators. What was often happening was that I was entering my final pay check of the month, covering all the over spent categories, and then attempting to fund my categories for the next month, but it often left me short, which put me into over spending for the next month, and then again, the final pay check of the month would cover the categories and I'd start all over again. However, this is annoying. The 3rd however, is a tough one for me to swallow. That being said, there's a link floating around which has a tool for running YNAB 4 on OSX Catalina (I think this is it, but I don't have this problem so I might be wrong https://gitlab.com/bradleymiller/Y64) . farfromtheusual There’s a difference between a business having adequate capital and being cash flow positive, and if you don’t know that, maybe you shouldn’t be lecturing me on the travails of entreprenurship. You can leave the overspend alone, or you can “turn the arrow to the right”. Funds will carryover to the new month if unused. make sure all the expenses are reimbursed)  The category often will have a negative balance, because there hasn't been time to be reimbursed. If you have general questions about covering overspending (or you're looking to know more about cash overspending), head over here. But there's a good reason that negative balances don't carry over by default(except for pre-YNAB debt). :) But if you cover with the payment category, the yellow/blue goes away and there's no net change to the category. I get some people are not responsible, but I'm being punished because nYNAB doesn't want to have grown-ups manage their money. To others that involves SEEING it in the account balance. Since that approach incurs interest, the characterization of "best" is debatable. Yes, yes, I'm well aware of YNABs rules and why they think this is a "feature" but it's not. I don't mind looking at it for the month, partly because I get paid at the end of ther month, which hits right before the first, so I can often catch up my over spending at that point. I strive to reallocate from somewhere LESS important BEFORE overspending. lindsay_g as long as that reasoning isn't used to excuse chronic issues with something, I have no problem with it. farfromtheusual I guess I'm having trouble understanding why uncovered credit-based overspending is a regular thing (outside of reimbursements). The goal next to the budgeted is one of my favorite toolkit features. I ask this question, YNAB4 did wonders for me, taking a system I used to do exactly on paper into this system that kept track electronically, it let me do some "fudging" in a way that really worked for me, like it did Brandon. It's so much easier to track things that way when you need to be paid back by others. Then again, if income and expense arrival times conspire against you, that's just the way the ball bounces. However, what's the difference between that and carrying forward a negative balance to the next month in that category? Do I wish that they would throw a bone to the users who are in financially secure positions and are looking to optimize spending rather than get out debt? I used to be a nickel-and-dime overspender, going over each category in inconsequential small amounts which added up to bigger amounts. B. Not meeting the goal will throw up a visual indicator. For like, 3 months maybe, I was all I can't live without the arrow and then I forgot I ever needed it, and I'm so much better off for it. Carry negative balance. YNAB wants/expects the user to deal with this as it happens and not just leave it (Rule 3 and all that), but will fix it for you as a last resort if you don't deal with it yourself. I created this workflow because it seemed a lot of my travel occurred the last week of the month and I hated that negative money carrying forward to the next month. I have submitted feature requests to YNAB officially for this, but they don't seem to entertain it. The interfaces is dated, though and the transfer from the old MV4 to MV5 is not going smoothly, so I thought I'd look at YNAB again to see if things had improved. YNAB will correct it for you at the end of the month if you leave it overspent by not allowing you to be able to budget that overspending in the next month. That assumes your purchases are made with a CC. One solution is to budget for them assuming they will occur at the end of the month. Hi all. Generally speaking,  I'd say that containing the overspending in a category is exactly the wrong thing to do. dakinemaui I agree, but SFTF may be hiding that a bit based on some of the things the OP has said. This will create a positive in that category. Rationally, a program implementation of cash overspending with fluid months might never move the category below zero, just take it out of TBB this month. This is one of our longer term goals, but it is on our radar! See this: Pink Piccolo You can also get a refund on your unused portion of your nYNAB subscription if you choose to cancel. Your last question–yes, I’ve tried both for extended periods and we’re back to Mvelopes for the last 6 months. OTOH, if you're talking about taking it out of the current month's TBB (when your rolling period ends in this month) and next month's TBB (when your rolling period ends in next month) -- I believe far more users will be confused by that inconsistency than they are at present. You can roll a balance over and credit. Again a negative balance would make this process sooo much easier because I could see what money is still owed, rather than having to open the category and track transactions manually after YNAB resets the balance. Once they are directed to the relevant teaching resource they seem to sort it out. It would be nice if they brought back Income for